Spacesuit pressure limits, what's reasonable?

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atermonera
Posts: 149
Joined: Mon May 22, 2017 3:03 am

Wed Dec 12, 2018 7:14 am

In https://github.com/PolarisSS13/Polaris/pull/5776, I've added pressure limits to clothing, notably space suits and the firefighter's suit, where they only provide protection within certain pressure ranges. This resolves the issue of firesuits being spaceproof, but introduces the balance discussion of how much pressure each suit should reasonably be built to withstand. I've also given the (orange) anomaly suit weak resistance, so that anomalists don't die immediately when they turn something on and it starts eating all the air.

The current values are mostly placeholders pending actual discussion, with most space-proof suits being able to withstand up to 20 atmospheres of pressure, the atmos suit and CE rig being able to withstand up to 100, and the firesuit being good between 0.8 atmospheres and 50 atmospheres, with the upper bound as a midpoint between spacesuits designed for space, and the atmos suit. The anomaly suit is rated between 0.7 atmospheres and 5 atmospheres.

What values do you think are reasonable? Softsuits should have lesser pressure resistance than voidsuits, perhaps as low as 1.5-2 atmospheres, most voidsuits probably don't need to withstand more than 10-15, but these are once again pretty arbitrary numbers not based in having had to deal with high-pressure mishaps recently.

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aimlessAnalyst
Posts: 59
Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2018 7:24 pm

Wed Dec 12, 2018 12:15 pm

I feel like firesuits should be able to go down a little further. Fires often vent the area to space once they break a window and any poor bastard fighting in a suit's going to get a nasty surprise that they can't actually change out of without exposing themselves to all the fuckery even more. I feel like that was the point of firesuits, in a sense. Not free spacewalking, but a way to..... not kill firefighters when the room suddenly vents.

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ZekeSulastin
Posts: 62
Joined: Sat May 13, 2017 11:15 pm

Wed Dec 12, 2018 4:41 pm

I agree with AA - any substantial firefighting effort would have to account for the threat of sudden vacuum, and since this entire thing started because of the firesuit... I do not think I have seen any minor fires where overpressure became a hazard (and if you are carrying a fire extinguisher, you can put yourself out before issue 5774 hurts you too much) and major fires and/or burning oil blobs have a tendency to melt walls and poke welder tanks. Planetside is a thing, but we do not tend to have things ignite there except explorers in spider nests! Unfortunately, someone who would be wearing a fire suit instead of something better would likely be lacking the tools needed to escape a vacuum in the 30 second window you get with internals on (magboots to fight off ZAS knockdown, picking up a crowbar to open a dropped shutter, glass or inflatables to make a barrier so you do not get ZAS'd right back in, non-atrocious slowdown etc.) - and if you have all of that, why would you not just wear a proper voidsuit or rig with less slowdown and either a backpack or useful built-in tools?

It seems like a neat enough system and I can see where the flexibility to have pressure ranges would be nice going forward, but the current implementation really feels to me like it's using an edge situation that I don't think I've ever seen abused to swing around the nerfbat (given what you said about softsuits, I'm legit surprised a buff is part of this patch). It just makes a really niche suit even more niche (and frankly feels less fun), and it is a perfectly reasonable solution to an issue to say "that should be intentional going forward" and code around it.

I kind of just wonder why we could not just resprite the firehat as a space helmet and call it a day, or at least take more time to evaluate pressure situations. It's not like it's hard to find a softsuit or two before you even get off the arrivals shuttle if you want to get "free spacewalks" that badly.

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Specific suit comments: the EVA rig should really be closer to the CE/atmos suit with the final numbers - atmos techs can use it just as much as regular engineers can, it has equivalent temperature protection (I AM NOT ASKING TO NERF THAT.), and its RCD makes it pretty well suited to the FTL method of breaking the fire triangle.

The current firesuit works well enough for toxins safety - I just usually try to grab an atmos suit because it has the same level of heat protection, magboots, less slowdown, and room for your air tank and a backpack. Back when I breached toxins fairly regularly, in the firesuit I would be safe from fire but take like 70 brute from being ZAS'd all over the place, whereas the atmos suit with magboots would keep me upright and let me properly vent (or escape) to space if it wasn't already. The AMI rig also works if you are planning on venting to space, but it doesn't have the open backpack slot. or the neat sprite

The anomaly suit buff is neat, and makes it actually useful when compared to the excavation suit. Thanks for that at least.

atermonera
Posts: 149
Joined: Mon May 22, 2017 3:03 am

Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:31 pm

So like, closer to 0.1-0.2 atmospheres lower bound? They still won't provide any protection against 0kPa (i.e., space tiles) unless the lower bound is set to 0, because protection falls off based on percentage.

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